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Author Topic:   1977 Z28
rich m
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posted September 07, 2003 11:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
I can't seem to get it to open either. I remember years ago, there was a Camaro videotape that said it had this commercial, but I didn't buy it in time and I never got to see it! As big a nut for this car as I was back then, I never saw it air on TV, either.
I'll look up those articles shortly, by the way. And only one person asked about the "missing 18" '77 Z28s !!!! Guess nobody wants to hear about them after all. I'd like to get in touch with this Jeff Betz guy, by the way, if he's that big on the '77. Can anybody get in touch with him? 1002 points out of 1000, man!!!!!! Incredible!

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nwz28
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posted September 07, 2003 11:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for nwz28   Click Here to Email nwz28     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Rich, I am also interested in the 18 "missing" '77 Z-28's. Also, where did you get that press kit? I have been looking for one for years. Would you be willing to copy it for me? I couldn't get the commercial to play either. Perhaps one of our more computer literate members could burn a CD or DVD or whatever for us for a small fee.
Jeff Betz is definately an authority on these cars and does have the nicest one on the planet. He checks this board once in a while and will probably have something to add to this discussion.

Hi Chuck - Are you ready for Carlisle 2004?
Only 10 months to go!

-Nick

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rich m
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posted September 08, 2003 01:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
OK guys, I'm home. It's late, but I'm going to list my collection of 1977 Z28 magazines for any of you that collect literature on them. If you don't have an issue, this list will at least tell you what specific issues to look for, either with literature dealers or on E Bay. Some of these are very obscure titles and may be very hard to find:

Daytona Speed Weeks "Press Kit" (I bought this last year from a literature dealer, may have been McLellan's, but I'm not sure. I may have paid $20-25 for it, don't really remember that, either. I was just surprised to come across it as I had never even heard about it!) Comes in a really cool oversized white envelope with the Z28 logo printed in color! Inside are 2 8x10 B&W glossies, the ones that every car mag in the country copied in their release articles, as well as a 3 page PR release and 1 page spec sheet, which all those magazine writers blindly copied from as well.

Auto Week - Feb 26, '77 (Vol.27, issue#9) (has a small 1/2 page PR release from the infamous Daytona Speed Weeks Z28 release event, that's where the Press Kits were distributed to various magazine & newspaper writers)

Motor Trend - April '77 (1/3 page PR release from Chevrolet announcing the Z's return)

Car & Driver - April '77 (Cover shot, many pages, many color pics, comparison with '77 T/A)

Hot Rod - April '77 (6 pages, 1 color photo, plus the well known Chevrolet Z28 ad!!!)

Motor Trend - May '77 (3 pages)

Road Test - May '77 (2 page piece on the prototype car, which had no decals and chrome bumpers!)

Road/Track - June '77 (30th Anniversary Special Edition) (has a one page PR release announcing the return of the Z)

Road Test - June '77 (Cover shot of red '77, 6 pages inside with a few color pics)

Auto Report - July '77 (4 pages which have a 2 page color shot)

Super Stock (& Drag Illustrated)- July '77 (4 pages)

Chevy Action - July '77 (3 pages, not too good, mostly quotes from a Chevy PR piece that is in the "Press Kit", though we couldn't know that at the time!)

Car Craft - August '77 (4 pages with B&W pics includes test of the Z, including that "prototype" car seen in only one other magazine, as well as the L82 'Vette and a Monza Spyder)

Super Chevy - August '77 (Awesome cover shot of a red car, made me immediately wish that I had ordered a red car instead of a brown one like in the original release ad!!! 5 pages inside as well, with many B&W pics)

Street Cruisin' - August '77 (yeah, I know ... who the hell ever heard of THIS one??!!!) (4 pages with several color pics of that same red car!)

Street Racer - October '77 (yep, when the '78s were already out! And who ever heard of THIS one, either??!!!) (5 pages, with color pics of a silver car!)

In addition to these, I have unsuccessfully looked for articles in (Hi Performance) CARS, Popular Hot Rodding, Chevy Power, Chevy Bible, Street Power, Street Machine, and Hot Cars. I have checked every issue of (H.P.) CARS and Popular Hot Rodding for that year, and no articles appear that I know of. I believe that Street Machine may have done one, but I've seen 8 of 12 issues and there wasn't one in those. Auto Week I believe did a road test feature, but I can't track down which issue. The rest were mostly obscure, short lived bi-monthy magazines which are super hard to come by. Also, I have a March '77 issue of Friends magazine, a Chevrolet PR sheet sent out to dealers and favored customers, and the Z ad is in there, but no article, though there may have been one in another issue.

I also recommend "Camaro! From Challenger to Champion:The Complete History", a now out of print book by Gary Witzenburg that can be found at Amazon.com or on E bay from time to time. Has a great behind the scenes detail of the Camaro's (and Z28's) history and developemnet back then.

I also recall (but can't seem to find) an article in the early '80s that talks about the re-released second generation Z's, and specifically said that the infamous '77 hood decal was done because the fake scoop that appeared in '78 was supposed to be on the '77 (but not the fender louvers or wheel spats), but that the tooling for the mold wasn't ready in time, so they did a hood decal in the same basic shape as the scoop.

One last thing. We've all seen the infamous '77 Z28 print ad, but at nastyz28.com there is a different ad, this one using the slogan "The Sporty Car as a Legend"

http://nastyz28.com/camaro/1977/77z28br.jpg

Can anyone tell me where that ad may have been placed? I'd love top find out!

Well, I know it's a loooong post, but I hope it's been informative. If you have any issues that aren't listed here, please share them with the rest of us. Anyone else ever heard about the "missing 18" '77 Z's, by the way??? Let me know! Thanks guys.

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rich m
Veteran Member
posted September 08, 2003 08:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Well, it's been a while since I've added any new "old" magazines to the above collection, but I just bought another issue on E Bay, Road Test - August 1977, with an article "Supertuning the Z28 Camaro". Seller told me the car in the article was a '77. I'll let you know if it's worth it to chase one down.

Getting ready to talk about the "missing 18" cars soon, too much to do in the meanwhile!

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COPO
Veteran Member
posted September 08, 2003 11:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for COPO   Click Here to Email COPO     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Visit COPO's Homepage!   View COPO's car!
I ordered a new 1977 Z28, 1978 Z28 and a 1980 Z28, all were 4-spds.
see http://members.rogers.com/mlvd/my_z28's.htm

------------------
Mark
4spd Z28's owned '68,'71,'77new,'78new,'80new,70 still,daily driver 87 G/N.
Home Page on 1970 Z28
http://members.rogers.com/mlvd/

Chevy's Baddest Toys
http://members.rogers.com/ldd54/

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nwz28
Veteran Member
posted September 08, 2003 11:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for nwz28   Click Here to Email nwz28     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Rich, Thanks for the list! I thought my collection was good, but there were a few on there I don't have which I'll have to look for. I have 9 out of your 15 articles. Here's the only one I have that you didn't have:

Super Chevy - June 1977 - 2 Page article with the same pictures and information.

That 'Ad' on MadMike's Site is NOT an ad. It's a page out of a brochure titled 'The sportiest Chevys from Corvette to Chevette'.
It's a half size, 8 page booklet which is probably available from any of the literature dealers.

Thanks for the info on the Press Kit. I'll try to hunt one down this week.

Thanks again for sharing you list. I'll keep you posted on my quest for a Press Kit. - Nick

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rich m
Veteran Member
posted September 08, 2003 11:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Nick,
Thanks for the heads up on the Super Chevy issue, as well as that other Z28 "ad".. I have some spares of some of those issues, some in great shape, some so-so. I'll put together a list for you. Also, I'd be glad to copy the Press Kit for you, you may have a tough time finding an original. If not McLellan's, maybe Walter Miller? Give me a little time and I'll see what I can do for copies (don't let me forget though).

COPO, neat car! Not many done in silver! Where did you order it when new, and what's the production date on the cowl tag (that's a clue to the "missing 18" cars, by the way!). Silver and orange I believe were the most rare of the seven colors.

Neat thread, guys! Where's Jeff Beltz???

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That70sCar
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posted September 09, 2003 09:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for That70sCar   Click Here to Email That70sCar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Visit That70sCar's Homepage!   View That70sCar's car!
Rich,
The video I got this commercial from is called "The Story of Camaro". I got it from Classic Motorbooks abot 10 years ago, but I don't think they sell it any more. There is that 30 second 1977 Z28 commercial, but other than that it's mostly first gen info. I also have a 1970 Camaro commercial that's on my website as well. I'm sorry the .MPG file won't play for you; I've tried on some other PC's and it seems like it will only play in the Windows XP Media player.
Mike

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[This message has been edited by That70sCar (edited September 09, 2003).]

[This message has been edited by That70sCar (edited September 09, 2003).]

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rich m
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posted September 09, 2003 10:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Just found that publication with the "other Z28 ad", it's a brochure from Chevrolet itself that I never saw before!!!! Awesome! Thanks for the info, I'm going to try and paste the cover on here later!

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rich m
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posted September 09, 2003 04:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
OK, I did a little more checking on my somewhat dormant literature collection. Here's what else I came up with:

Street Racer - September 1978 (that's right folks, almost a year and a half AFTER the car was released, and about the same time the new '79 model was released!) re-printed the same article that was in their October '78 issue, minus one page of color pics)

Hot Rod Magazine's "Camaro" special issue (Vol.1 No.4)printed in 1983, ran an article entitled "The Top Ten" which claimed the 1977 Z to be one of the top ten best Camaros ever built. Has a one page article which is basically a reprint of the 1977 Chevy PR release.

One other bit of trivia .... did any of you know that the '77 Z was the feature of a print ad, for Western Wheels? It was in the April 1978 issue of Car Craft magazine, which showed what I guess was supposed to be a red Z, but looked more like a burnt cinnamon, wearing Western's knock-off of Cragar S/S rims (I'm going to have to try scanning that for you).

I also went through my duplicate issues, and have one extra each of: Hot Rod 4/77, Motor Trend 5/77,Road Test 6/77,Super Stock 7/77, Super Chevy 8/77, Street Cruisin' 8/77,Street Racer 10/77, and Street Racer 9/78

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CamarosRus
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posted September 09, 2003 04:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CamarosRus   Click Here to Email CamarosRus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Jeff Betz doesnt have web site for his car NOR probably wants one....I have pics I can send to someone in ZIP file if "YOU" can host and POST here.....let me know......Chuck Sharin/////EMAIL ME !!!!!

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CamarosRus
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posted September 09, 2003 04:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CamarosRus   Click Here to Email CamarosRus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
YOU ALL BETTER (SHOULD) support this CLUB's (you and me friends) website and plan for next years Carlisle, F-body gathering in Atlanta and so on......This web site is GREAT , but need people like Nick and others to show up in MASS at Carlisle, Super Chevy INDY etc to help solidify our Camaro "obsession"
Chuck ........going back to sedation now

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Jeff77Z28
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posted September 09, 2003 07:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jeff77Z28   Click Here to Email Jeff77Z28     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Wow all of this excitement about 77 Z28's and my lazy but has been off the website for 2 weeks plus! Thanks Nick for letting me know all of the discussion is going on. You and Chuck keep me on the honest side! I do not have a website and I have only a few electronic pictures of my car. Chuck has a few and can post, if I can figure it out I'll get some on here. I will take more this weekend at the NEOCC show too.

I bought my car in 1991 at a local cruise. It was a 70,000 mile Michigan car but very very unmolested and decent. Had been repainted but original alt, starter, dist, carb, eng, trans and rearend. Yellow 4speed with air, windows, locks, standard interior. I was a GM engineer at the time and did alot of research and buying of NOS parts. In 96 I officially started the restoration and in 99 I finished it and went to Super Chevy Indy for the first time. Been to many shows since and have talked with many other 77 Z28 enthusiasts. It was an affordable car to get into and was a real challenge to restore. Try to find colored emblems, right? We all know that one! Anyways, I may not be the most active on this board, but as winter comes I do better. Drop me an email at 77Z28Jeff@comcast.net and I will help anyone anyway that I can. I need to update my profile here which I will do right now with the correct email.

Jeff Betz

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nwz28
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posted September 09, 2003 10:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for nwz28   Click Here to Email nwz28     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Rich, If you would be willing to part with the Street Cruizin' 8/77, Street Racer 10/77, and Street Racer 9/78 I would be happy to buy them from you. Send me an Email at nwz28@aol.com. By your profile, I see you are in Rhode Island. I am in Upstate New York. Perhaps we could get together some time. If your car is all original I would love to see it.

Now, what's this about the 18 missing '77 Z-28's?

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rich m
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posted September 09, 2003 11:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for rich m   Click Here to Email rich m     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote      
Nick,

I'd be glad to set you up with those mags, and a copy of the press kit as well. I'll e-mail you soon about it. By the way, I found the receipt for the Press Kit. I bought it last November, from McLellan's Automotive History for the tidy sum of $35 (ouch!!!!)

As far as seeing my car, remember the "missing 18", and that mine was one of them .... that's all part of the story. A little background to start off with ....

We all know that in 1977, Camaros (and hence, Z28s) were built in two different plants. We've been told that cars ordered from the western U.S. (west of the Mississippi) were built in Van Nuys CA, and cars in the eastern U.S. (east of the Mississippi) were built in Norwood OH. We also know that there is a "plant" code right there in the VIN, correct? L is for Van Nuys, N is for Norwood.

We also all know that there is a 3 digit code on the cowl tags of Camaros that tells the rough assembly dates of these cars (ie: 06A denotes a car built in the first week of June).

OK, let's get into the "Wayback" machine .... it's 1977, March to be exact. At Ft.Polk LA, there is a young MP about to get married, and in need of a new set of wheels. He almost ordered a blue RoadRunner 360 automatic, but had instead put a deposit down on this kick ass new Pontiac called the Can Am. Big car, Trans Am 6.6 400, shaker scoop.

One day, he opens up a copy of the Army Times, and there it is ...... you've all seen the ad by now, but back in the day, it stopped your heart COLD ..... They're making the Z28 again!!!!!! And it's AWESOME!!!!!!!! Cancel the Can Am order, I gotta get me one of these things!!!! And in brown, just like the one in the picture! (which I STILL have, to this very day!!!)

So, it's down to Fontenot Chevrolet, in good ol' Sleazeville (I mean Leesville) LA to see what the local dealer can tell me about it. And that turns out to be absolutely NOTHING. Guy didn't even know the damn car was available! So it's off to the news store to round up some magazines and get educated myself. (Who knew that 26 years later, I'd still have those magazines, and be telling strangers on this thing called the internet all about them???).

Now better educated, and armed with a brochure from the local dealer and an Edmunds price guide, I venture off to Houston TX to order myself a brandy new Z28 from a dealer that knows what the hell they're talking about!

Stay tuned for Part II (or: A.J. Foyt is an a*%-hole !!)

[This message has been edited by rich m (edited September 09, 2003).]

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