Shane, I've been scanning my original Chevrolet Literature all night, and here's what I discovered (I'll post a link to my source ASAP, bear with me please):

1977 Z28 production began on Feb 1st, 1977.

Happy 27th Birthday, '77 Z28! (BTW, my own birthday is Feb. 2nd, how cool is that?!)

The Z28 was unveiled to the motoring press at Daytona Speedway on Feb. 18th, and was unveiled to the public at the Chicago Auto Show on Feb. 26th. Last year I bought a show program from that Chicago Auto Show, and there is not a single mention or ad in it for the Z28, by the way.

So Shane, your car wasn't the first one built, but considering that 14,000 plus were built into August, and that many of the first production cars were loaned out to car magazines for road tests and articles, your car may be one of the earliest to actually reach the public. It's well worth holding on to!

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[This message has been edited by 77LTZ (edited February 05, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by 77LTZ (edited February 05, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by 77LTZ (edited February 05, 2004).]

quote:

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Originally posted by 77LTZ:
Hi all...saw the topic and thought i'd join all you 77'ers. I actually have one of the more rare combos a 77LTZ28. It's no longer original and doesn't have the decals either, however I plan on adding the racing stripes to my current setup. Also upgraded the 305HO with a 355c.i. 400HP 423ft-lb. 4:10 rear. TH350 race prepped. I also changed the deluxe cloth interior to the more traditional vinyl and the cloth door panels to the standard three piece door panels with the lower pocket.

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Hi, LTZ, welcome to the thread! A couple of simple questions for you, not to dispute you or "go after" you, but rather to authenticate and learn from you.

First, how long have you owned this car, and how many previous owners has it had? Next, how did you determine that it was A) an authentic '77 Z28, and B) a Type LT? Third, do you have a "Build Sheet" for this car? Also, on the cowl tag, does it read "1FQ87"? Lastly, you mention a "305" motor .... is this an original engine to this car?

Thanks for taking the time to post here, and for responding to these questions as well!

First, of all the articles I've amassed, only one refers to whether the Z28 was an option or a separate model (Hot Rod, April 1977), and it says that the Z28 could be ordered as an option on the LT. I have never read this anywhere else, whether aftermarket sources or from Chevrolet themselves, and this could be at least SOME of the source for the mis-understanding behind this.

Another magazine article (Car Craft, August 1977) states that the Z28 they are testing is equiped with a Corvette L48 350, NOT the LM1 that we all know was original equpment.

A REAL find was in that same article. One of the two '77 Z28s they were testing was the "Prototype" car that I alluded to in an earlier post, and they mention finding a Chevrolet Engineering "log book" inside a hidden panel of that car. They even show a photograph of the book, and lo and behold, there is a handwritten entry, complete with the date, clearly displayed in that photo. The "Prototype" car was in use and developement as early as November 1, 1976!!!

There was also a differnet article, from Super Stock/Drag Illustrated, that talks in length about the unveiling of the '77 Z28 at that Daytona "Speed Weeks" announcement!

Okay, the first matter we can discuss is: was the Z28 available as an option on an 'honest to God" Type LT Camaro. We should know that there were two distinct Camaro models in 1977, the base Sport Coupe (model 1FQ87) and the Type LT (1FS87). So why don't we let Chevrolet's own factory literature tell us the story on this. Here goes;

This first paper is from the Chevrolet Motor Vehicle Price Schedule, which was revised to all dealers in June 1977 (and which was sent to me from Chevrolet's Customer Assistance Center back in the mid-80's!) Note, the yellow highlighting is mine.

[IMG] http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/511000-511999/511223_1_full.jpg [/IMG]

Under the heading "8 cylinder engine", it says "Z28. Next to that is the model availability, 1FQ87. No 1FS87 for the Type LT.

Next, is a different paper from the same set, this one under the heading "RPO Z28 Option".

[IMG] http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/511000-511999/511223_4_full.jpg [/IMG]

At the top, under "Model Availability", it clearly states "Standard Camaro 1FQ87". Again, the 1FS87 for the Type LT is no where to be found.

Next, we have a one page color mid-year insert for that 3 ring "Dealer Book" I mentioned before.

[IMG] http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/511000-511999/511223_9_full.jpg [/IMG]

At the top of that page, it clearly states "Camaro Z28 Sport Coupe (Model No. 1FQ87/Z28". Does anyone see Model No. 1FS87/Z28 anywhere? No.

Lastly, this is from a black & white mid-year insert for that same "Dealer Book", but the back side, which details color options, interior color choices, and the different stripe kit combinations available depending on exterior and interior color combinations. I'm saving the front of this b&w page for a different point later!

[IMG] http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/511000-511999/511223_8_full.jpg [/IMG]

As you can clearly see, once again, under "Model", it states only one: "1FQ87/Z28".

That, my friends, is 4 separate factory references to model availability on the Z28 option for 1977, and not once is the 1FS87 Type LT listed as an available model for this option.

Questions, anyone? Does anyone have a build sheet (box number 76) or Cowl Tag, that says "1FS87" instead of "1FQ87" ?

Hope these images all came out OK.

No disrespect to either Sharon or Mad Mike, but this is pretty authentic sourcing, wouldn't you say? (Or to put it mildly, LOL, "Who's your Guru now ?!!!)

[This message has been edited by rich m (edited February 05, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by hotrodman76 (edited February 06, 2004).]

First, Chevrolet (U.S.) does in fact keep very detailed records of what they build, to the point where they know how many Camaro's they built, how many of each of the two distinct models there were (Sport Coupe vs. Type LT), and how many of either were built with specific options (how many had the Z28 option, how many had tilt wheel, how many of each color, etc.). They just choose not to offer this information to the general public, such as Pontiac does.

As for the 1FS87 (Type LT model designation), no, that wouldn't appear in the VIN. I never stated that it would. I said it would appear on the COWL TAG. The beginning numbers in the Camaro VIN are the same for both the base Sport Coupe AND the Type LT, which is 1Q87. The 1 is for Chevrolet, the Q is for Camaro, and the 87 is for the body style, a two door coupe (which both the base Sport Coupe and the Type LT are!). The separate model designations DO NOT show up in the VIN.

I never suggested that all of those who think they own a Z28/LT are driving clones. Rather, I am suggesting that they are confused. Their Z28 base Sport Coupe (which every '77 Z28 was!) may have come with the Type LT interior, which I have said was NOT available on the base Sport Coupe EXCEPT when the base Sport Coupe model is ordered with the Z28 option. In that case, and in that case ONLY, the Type LT interiors (either vinyl or cloth) COULD be ordered on a base Sport Coupe.

Hope that clears things up on this point. I will offer documentation on the interior subject later tonight.

I'm not saying that there wasn't even a single Type LT 1977 Z28 produced, I'm saying that Chevrolet didn't make it available on the Type LT. It's entirely possible that one slipped through the system, but it wasn't supposed to be. And the ONLY way to authenticate or verify one, would be to look for the 1FS87 on either the Cowl Tag, the Build Sheet, or the original Window Sticker.

You made mention in an earlier post (page 20) of someone at Chevrolet Customer Assistance named Marlon Mickles. You wouldn't happen to have an address or phone number for him, would you? I'd like to contact someone at Chevrolet PR/Customer Relations to help with a little research, and the 800 number operator says they don't know who he is.

Next: I've gone back through all 38 pages of posts (again!) and counted how many people on this thread have said that they actually own a '77 Z28. In the interest of research and accuracy, I'm going to ask those of you who have any (or all) of these items to scan them and e-mail them to me for this project. I assure confidentiality and security of this information, unless permission is given to share any info with the other board members. I want to protect your cars, and your privacy.

That said, I am looking for e-mail copies of;

Cowl Tags
Build Sheets
Window Stickers
Original Order Forms
Any other related literature

Those who own '77 Z28's, please respond;

ReD-DaWg-OnE
nwz28
IS777Z
DirtReynolds
Danial
Jeff77Z28
Kenny77
Sharon77
ggtsvnv
Caterpillar
Joe56P
Waynemustang
Dan77
Duece-bigalo01
77Z28Banana
Major Dad
Tomahawk
rkd
JJ Farmer (responded, thank you!)
Mikey 18
77LTZ

And those who used to own one, or bought one brand new, and may still have such items;

COPO
70CitrusZ
aero80

If I missed anyone, or someone is "lurking" out there without posting, please feel free to send your info in as well. If there are '77 Z28's near you, maybe check with those owners as well?

Send those e-mails to:

rmcdermott1@surfbest.net

Thanks for all of your help, folks.

[This message has been edited by rich m (edited February 06, 2004).]

From my 77 Z28 I have a copy of:
- the ordering guide

- my Dealer Order Confirmation page that looks like the window sticker with all the options and prices

- original copy of the dealer hand written order with what options I wanted

- the application for vehicle purchase for a direct sale since I worked in GM Salary

- all the yellow dealer work orders when I took the car in to get service under warranty.

- a letter from GM asking me how I like the car

BTW
No where in the order guide does it show that you can order a LT Z28.

PS I do have the build sheets from my 78 and 80 Z28's. Guess I should have looked more for the 77. I can't remember where the 78 and 80 copy was but I know it was in the open, like in the glove box or something.

I'm going to go to the DMV to get the owners list and see if my 77 Silver Z28 is still alive. I'd like to buy it back!!!!!

quote:

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Originally posted by tallman1970@yahoo.com:
Here's a light blue 77Z28 from one of my collections hope it works.

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Here ya' go George...

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Lanette, Gilbert AZ
The Surgeon General states: "IT IS OK TO SMOKE YOUR COMPETITION!!!!"