NastyZ28 Forum



Go Back   NastyZ28.com > General & Off-Topic Topics > The BS Topic
User Name
Password

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-15-2005, 01:32:08 AM   #1
Warchild145
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Marion, Iowa
Posts: 2,756
Question Slipping into neutral to slow down

Ok i had someone tell me today that to help slow down on the slippery roads that you can put it in neutral and it will help. I heard this once before a couple days ago and dont see how it would help at all so hoping someone can clarify this for me.

I always thought you keep it in gear and let the engine slow you down.
__________________
"If you love your life as much as I love my car then you won't steal it"

Last edited by Warchild145 : 12-15-2005 at 01:40:51 AM.
Warchild145 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 01:44:59 AM   #2
camaro75LT
Administrator
 
camaro75LT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Masshole
Posts: 5,929
in an auto, it can help to go into neutral to slow down, but on ice, i like 2 use the engines revs 2 slow the car down on ice. putting the vehical in neutral will make it easyer 2 lock the tires up assuming you dont have abs. with abs, i dont think it makes a difference.
__________________
The man formally known as "Baby Daddy"
camaro75LT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 01:51:44 AM   #3
night rider
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bremen, Ga
Posts: 6,139
I don't know if going to neutral will help as much as some people say.

I coast alot with my auto trans, and it seems like I speed up when I throw the shifter to N, it will speed up 1-5 mph for a few sec. then start to slow down.

Also I noticed the vac readings. Cruzing along I have like 23" or so of vac, throw it in N and vac drops down to 12" or so (bigger than stock cam) Less vac would mean brakes dont work as good right?

If I need to slow down w/o useing brakes I let the engine brake for me. Down shift if needed, and just stay off the throttle
night rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Messages from Our Sponsors !
Awesome NastyZ28.com Merchandise !!

T-shirts, wearing apparel

Drinkware, Mouse Pads, Decals

Old 12-15-2005, 01:51:59 AM   #4
Eric
Administrator
 
Eric's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Somewhere, Out Here, In the World
Posts: 11,258
??? Something missing in that statement. By shifting a vehicle into neutral you allow the drive wheels to "free wheel" if you're not applying the brakes- which eventually, based on road/surface friction will slow you down- because there's no power going to the drive wheels at all.

However, this would be/is ineffective in accomplishing anything- applying the brakes and releasing at the first sign of slippage in a non-ABS vehicle is far more effective/speedy in slowing you down. In a rear-wheel-drive vehicle, shifting to neutral can be far worse than leaving the car in gear- ever notice when you have forward propulsion/motion and your rear end slides out that if you let off the gas the rear end will correct itself- part of this is because the effective "engine braking" has slowed the wheels down during the start of the slip/the release of the throttle to when the rear wheels regain traction. If the car were put in neutral outright- the rear wheels would be freewheeling and once they regain traction they won't "grab" the road as rapidly to a) let you know you've got traction again and should start driving appropriately for the immediate needs and b) haven't slowed the car at all, leaving you travelling at the same speed, relatively, as when you hit the traction problem, and no ability to use the throttle to "blip" the wheels to see what the actual traction situation has become (i.e. better than previous but still unacceptable or A-Ok).

Maybe on a front-wheel-drive shifting to neutral is not as consequential because the weight is over the drivewheels and the vehicle "feel" is generally impaired by all the components attached to the 2 drive wheels- meaning once you've lost any control you're basically going to slide no matter what until the car regains complete traction on those 2 wheels- so perhaps being in neutral isn't negative- but I'm not sure it's positive either.

One thing to keep in mind here is that we're talking about automobiles- not tractor-trailers with a whole lot of weight on them to slow down/pull back the vehicle. I personally would be totally adverse to shifting to neutral if I lost traction- I think it can/will cause far more problems than it will solve.
Eric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 02:54:00 AM   #5
zbugger
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: My own personal hell...
Posts: 3,781
I've never heard that one before. I have heard, and do it all the time, that downshifting helps you slow down quicker though. I remember it being called compression braking, but I could be, and usually am, wrong. Anyway, if you drive down the road, take your foot off the gas. You'll feel the car slow down. As it does that, shift into neutral. You'll be able to decide for yourself better if that really does work.

On the other hand, a vacum issue was mentioned. Load on an engine will help keep the vacum up. As you slow down in gear, the revs are kept up a bit. This actually helps increase vacum and helps your power booster. Put into neutral the revs drop down faster and allow the vacum to drop to idle levels.

Damn, I wish I could make sense.....
zbugger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 07:27:47 AM   #6
John Wright
Lifetime Gold Member
 
John Wright's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Rustburg, Va
Posts: 13,364
The only time I ever remember shifting to "N" to get whoa'd up on a slick road was in my S-10 with the V-8. I had really low rear gears and if I let off the gas too quickly when travelling at a pretty good clip the rear tires would break loose due to the compression braking. But other than that, I wouldn't do it. I also had problems sitting at stop lights when the road was slick, the rear tires would start spinning on their own while I tried to hold the truck with the foot brake. Again this was in very, very slick conditions.
__________________
Life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes.
John Wright is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 08:10:53 AM   #7
punisher
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: johannesburg south africa
Posts: 71
when shifting a auto into neutral while the wheel are turning doesn't that stuff up the auto box? i heard it does as the oil doesn't circulate properly?
punisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 08:45:36 AM   #8
sniggle_t
Lifetime Gold Member
 
sniggle_t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Schenectady, NY
Posts: 1,893
Years ago when I worked at Sears in their automotive dept. I would use this trick to get into the garage. You see, there was always a large patch of ice in front of the bay doors during the winter and if you put the car into neutral and coasted over the ice. you had a much better chance of keeping the car straight. Only time I ever needed to do this.
__________________
I recently attended a sexual harassment seminar,
now I think I'll be really good at it!


NASCAR - Non Athletic Sport Centered Around Rednecks

Going to war over religon - "Basically it's killing each other to see who has the best imaginary friend"
sniggle_t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 09:02:28 AM   #9
At Home Camaro
Lifetime Gold Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Md
Posts: 713
Just a guess, but I'd say any slight benefit of traction from coasting is outweighed by the danger of not having the car in gear if you need to "GO".
At Home Camaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 09:39:19 AM   #10
camarochevy1970
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 7,464
I remember a situation a couple of years ago where I had to shift into nuetral. I was going down a hill that was a solid sheet of ice. No matter what I did, unless I completely stopped the car, it kept drifitng towards the ditch, everytime I took my foot off the brake at all, it went for the ditch.

Finally I got angry, and bumped it into nuetral, and it coasted right down the hill without any more issues. As far as I can tell, the drive wheel was slipping in the ice, and pulling the car off the road.
camarochevy1970 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 11:08:59 AM   #11
retorq
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Kingman, AZ
Posts: 4,920
TRUE!! The tranny pump is driven off the torque convertor, if you put it into neutral the engine RPMS drop to 800 or so, your trans internals are still moving along at 50 MPH or what ever, you won't have enough pressure to keep stuff properly lubed. There was a discussion in the competition area about this a while back, it's not good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by punisher
when shifting a auto into neutral while the wheel are turning doesn't that stuff up the auto box? i heard it does as the oil doesn't circulate properly?
__________________
The first digital hijinx I designed was quite naturally perfect. It was a work of art. Flawless. Sublime. A triumph only equaled by its monumental failure.
retorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 11:41:24 AM   #12
Gary S
Administrator
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Bismarck, North Dakota
Posts: 18,003
Automatic trannys give little or no "compression braking". Unless you have your engine idle set so low that you can put the car in gear on level ground, not touch the brake, and the car still does not move, you will gain by putting in neutral. I've never driven an automatic equipped car that would sit stationary on level ground in gear and not move unless the brakes were applied, so, YES, you will be a much safer driver on ice if you get in the habit of putting the car in neutral everytime you slow down and need to stop on ice.
A manual tranny transmits 100% of the engine's "compression braking" to the car, so you lose by putting it in neutral. With a manual, simply shift gently down one gear as you are slowing on ice and use the engine to help the brakes.
Gary S is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 02:34:06 PM   #13
Joekool
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Campbell CA USA
Posts: 5,679
Its all about wieght transfer, if you coast slowly to a stop in neutral you will have little wieght transfer to the front which will help keep the rear tires from losing traction (which will really help FWD cars since they dont have much wieght at all in the rear). My camaro has 4.10 gears, in third gear at WOT if I let of the gas the engines starts to slow her down really quick, automatics will compression brake but its exponetial, the faster your are going the more it will compression brake and the lower the rear gear the more it will do it.

True there is little oil flow in neutral but most automatics can be towed up to 5 miles with no oil flowing threw them at all, Im sure an automatic in neutral coasting down to a stop with a running engine can take a few hundred feet without suffering any damage at all. I pull my camaro into neutral all the time so my exhaust will be quieter when slowing down (I try to keep under the radar of the police) and I have never had any porblems.
Joekool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 03:51:56 PM   #14
Twisted_Metal
L. G. M. / Moderator
 
Twisted_Metal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bloomtown, MN
Posts: 22,764
I don't see a benefit in doing this as a standard procedure. ISn't going to help much, if any.

I did learn something about downshifting with a peg-leg rear on ice years ago... DON'T DO IT!

One wheel will try to spin backwards and turn your car into a spinning carnival ride.
__________________
} 8^{)
Twisted_Metal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2005, 05:09:03 PM   #15
sniggle_t
Lifetime Gold Member
 
sniggle_t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Schenectady, NY
Posts: 1,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted_Metal
I don't see a benefit in doing this as a standard procedure. ISn't going to help much, if any.

I did learn something about downshifting with a peg-leg rear on ice years ago... DON'T DO IT!

One wheel will try to spin backwards and turn your car into a spinning carnival ride.


Been there, done that.
__________________
I recently attended a sexual harassment seminar,
now I think I'll be really good at it!


NASCAR - Non Athletic Sport Centered Around Rednecks

Going to war over religon - "Basically it's killing each other to see who has the best imaginary friend"
sniggle_t is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



Copyright © 1997 - 2014 NastyZ28.com Inc.
Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.