Ok, a week ago I finally fixed my cars nose on and when I went to start the car it wouldn't start. It had just started perfectly about 3 hours earlier and never had a problem before. As I was trying to crank up the engine, it made a weird sound when it would turn over. Cant even describ it. To top it all off, the key got stuck in the run position. Well I got the key thing fixed(new igniion cylinder). I tried to turn on the car today and the engine turned over like it should and I didnt hear that bad sound. After a few tries(it usually would have started by then)the cranks began to slow down. Then eventually the engine wouldnt even turn over. I could hear it rotate very little and slowly, but it made a weird sound as it did. What do you guys think is wrong with my car?

Possably a bad silinoad in the starter.

Do some easy tests with a voltmeter- do you have 12.6 volts at your battery?

if you can reach the wire terminals- do you have low voltage drop across the wires? I believe you're only supposed to have .1 V drop across positive side wires. and if your wires are good- then I'd pull the starter and take a look at that. Sounds like a dead battery to me.

But, yeah, it could be the solenoid- you'd just better check the obvious stuff first.

I'm almost completely sure that its not the battery as all the electronics work and it had a perfect charge not too long ago. That leaves me to believe that its either the solenoid or starter. But how can I tell which? I dont want to buy a new solenoid and have the problem be the starter, or vice versa. Do ya'll think that since it was making a bad sound when it was previously cranking, it could more than likely be the starter?

sounds like a bad connection at the battery. I'd start with cleaning up the battery posts and the clamps, then tightening them down good.
My car will do this sometimes, and I always fix it by wiggling the battery cable, or cleaning them.

I cleaned the posts and made sure the cables had a good connection. Still wont start. It'll rotate just a little bit once but then nothing. Then I just repeat that and it never gets better. After trying to crank her a few times I noticed that the ground from the negative battery cable was hot. Sounds like a problem to me. But is it just that ground? Or is something else causing that ground to heat up? I'm guessing a new negative cable with a new ground wire and good crimping should fix it. Am I right?

It's certainly a good start. A waek ground will do what you are describing everytime.

Ok if its turning over slowly and then stopping and making kind of a clicking noise change your battery, as for it not starting make sure you have your cylinder wired up right. Other than that check for fuel and spark

It turns a bit then stops quick with a click sound. My neighbor said try to boost it first. So I did, nothing. Then he said its my alternator. Makes sense, I think its kinda old. It been on there before I bought the car. Gonna get one tonight...crossing my figers for the car to start tomorrow.

Good thinking, drop $180 on an altenator that has 0 to do with a car starting before trying a $10 cable.

i doubt its the altenator, you gave it a charge and it still didn't start, so that isn't your problem apperently. but i'm pretty novice

Like he said.. good call. drop 180 on something that has nothing to do with starting the car.

You said that the ground cable was hot... this just travels from the battery to the frame. This would indicate that you are getting current passing through the starter. Again, as has been said, you may have a dead starter. The solenoid may be defective, the windings may be shot, the starter drive itself may be fubar- or anything else. BUT you seem unwilling to check this out.

if you want to test the solenoid- have a friend try to start the car while you listen to the starter.. do you hear a solid click/clack kind of noise? if not, then EITHER your battery cables are kaput or their contacts on the frame / starter are corroded.. or your starter solenoid is dead. Or your battery is dead. Have you checked it yet? You say it powers lights and stuff but thats like 2 amps compared with 70. heck you could even have resistance within a worn cable preventing current flow. Water can travel up poorly insulated wires and rust them up where you can't see it. Like I said, a $5 voltmeter will let you know if your're losing power thru a wire.

Don't know what more to say.

[This message has been edited by Skaal-tel 79 (edited April 28, 2005).]

this started to happen AFTER you fixed the NOSE. Maybe, just maybe, the ground wire from the BAT to Block is bad and the little ground wire to the fender/nose was supplying enough in combo with the block ground to start the car. Check the ground to body now (you did connect it, right?). Replace both ground cables. Plus, were you grinding on the starter when the key got stuck? So maybe the starter is weak as well as the ground insufficient. So now you don't have enough current to flip the motor. It turns a bit then stops quick with a click sound and -BAT is hot.
Step 1: be sure the -BAT is tightly grounded on the block
Step 2: (as several have indicated) replace the -BAT cable including the small ground wire. If the engine starts, but slowly... STEP 3: replace the starter/solenoid too.

------------------
1974 Sport Coupe. Original Owner.
383 SBC, TH350, 3:42 posi, rear discs, IROC steering box.

The only way I could see anything even remotely related to the starter causing this issue, is if your is setup like mine, and a ground wire that goes to the alternator bracket that has become lose.

Otherwise, you should be able to start that car with no belt on the alternator at all.

You can always take the alternator off and have it tested for free.... http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

You say the battery had "a perfect charge not too long ago". How long is "not too long ago" ? How old is the battery? Have you checked it to make sure there are no dead cells? A shorted cell could make your ground wire hot, and cause the battery to not have enough juice to crank over the motor.

The guys have all given you good ideas on fixing your problem. Your neighbor doesn't have a clue. If you want to throw down some dough at the local Auto Zone, or whatever, then fork out $40.00 for a new starter and solenoid. You may also want to replace the battery cables for a few additional dollars.

As another suggestion, before you spend any money, pull the battery and have it tested for integrity and charge. If it's O.K., then pull the starter and have it checked. Most auto parts stores (like Auto Zone) will do this for FREE.

Good luck, and let us know how you're doing.

I'm gonna try to take the alternator and battery to get tested tomorrow or saturday. Maybe its just a dead battery cell because then a boost wouldnt even start the car but the other electronics could still funtion like in my case. I'll check the ground one last time but I'm pretty sure they ar solid by now. The ground to the fender is not very tight, but there is enough contact for it to work. I mean I drove it that way for the past year and a half. We'll see where I get with this saturday.

did you replace the neg batt cable? if it's getting hot, that sounds like it's building some resistance in the wire, which could indicate burned out wiring inside. I'd check the resistance on that cable as well.

Where is the neg cable attached to? You mentioned the frame? I've got mine bolted to the alternator bracket. Makes for a good ground that won't be interfered by possible bad conduction through the motor mounts.

Jeff, the battery had been checked about a month ago and was fine. I dont have anything to test it with right now so I'm taking it to autozone to test it. The engine only rotated that little bit today, then the starter started clicking. Thats it, just the clicking. Might be the battery or starter, its gotta be one of those two.

Is it just me or does anyone else think bad ring gear or starter pinion when Redge talks about a horrible noise?

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by gin man:
Is it just me or does anyone else think bad ring gear or starter pinion when Redge talks about a horrible noise? </font>

Yes sir!

There's really not too much to the starting system.

-Battery voltage- 12.6v
-Battery post to cable voltage drop- .1v MAX
-Maximum Voltage Drop across starting circuit- .5v on + side .2v on - side .7v total.

-Check Battery ground
-Check Starter Ground
-Inspect Starter positive cable post
-Clean your battery

Turn on your headlights and see how it reacts with the cranking then reply.

There's really not much else to it.

If you want to do a lame alternator test, put your voltmeter on AC and put it across the terminals. The meter is pretty slow updating put if you see more than .5v the diodes are bad in the alternator.

Stay the course Redge. Let us know what you find out.

Make sure the frame and engine are grounded. What I do is run the battery negative to the frame and then a strap or cable to the engine block. Engine needs grounded like was said in the above post. You could take a jumper cable and clamp to the negative side of the battery and clamp it directly to the starter, that would answer the ground question. I have seen shifter cables and clutch cables burnt off cars that did not have a good engine ground. Mark

Friday I charged the battery which was down to 10 volts. When I turned the key I still heard the same loud continuous clicking sound. It was late at night by then so I waited to start again today. So I bought a new starter and solenoid, bolted it up, and turned the key. Nothing happened. No click, no lights, no nothing. Got the battery checked again and it had dropped down to 6 volts. Got a new battery from sears, dropped it in, turned the key one last time and VROOOOM! I had the old starter and solenoid tested, it failed everything. So the key, starter, and solenoid went out last weekend and within that time the battery crapped out too. I'm glad all that testing and checking crap is over. Thanks for all the help and tips along the way guys.

[This message has been edited by Redge (edited May 01, 2005).]

Hey Redge, Glad to hear you got her running! Sounds like you had a shorted out cell in your battery. Could have caused the starter failure as well, seen it happen before.

Anyway, ENJOY! http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/smile.gif

Yep- enjoy the runnin vehicle.

Aren't you glad you did some diagnosis instead of throwing an altenator at it?? http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by retorq:
Aren't you glad you did some diagnosis instead of throwing an altenator at it?? http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/biggrin.gif</font>

Heck yeah! Tomorrow she comes out of the garage as a daily driver again. I wanted to run her a few days just cruisin' to make sure everything was in good working order. Dude I miss driving her so much. Well I'm off to go fill up her first tank of gas at over $2 a gallon....ever.