Hi

I am going to replace my old exhaust system (or what to call the crap that used to be under my car) and I´m looking for a system that looks and fits nice, I don't want the muffler mounted under the floor because of all the clearence problems that involves.
When I checked out Classic Industries latest catalouge at page 564 I saw that they are selling a aluminized exhaust system with an original apperance.

Is it any good, should you put it on your car?

2" for SB sounds a little small, is there any differences (angles etc.) exept for the size between SB or BB, if not should I go for 2 1/2"?

Thanks/ Magnus

Here's a picture of the system I am talking aboout.

http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload5/Exhaust.jpg

Magnus

A 2" system is too small, if you also have performance in mind. I'd go with at least a 2 1/4". Or better yet, a 2 1/2" system.

That looks like a direct stock replacement? If it is those mufflers are scrap. I had an fairly new one around here and that's what I ended up doing with it after moving it a half dozen times. Plus those pipes don't look mandrel bent. I'd have to say pass on that and look at something else.


[This message has been edited by sikzdrivr (edited December 28, 2004).]

For about $50 more, buy a Flowmaster system through Summit Racing. It's 2 1/2 inches and has all mandrel bends with a single dual inlet / dual outlet muffler. It's made for application to headers, and I think is listed to fit '70 to '74 Camaro / Firebird, but will fit all through '81.
If you get it, you may have to cut one of the front pipes due to different header lengths.

Listen to 3" 40 series flowmasters here on a 350
http://www.supermotors.org/getfile/163599/fullsize/Idlin%20smooth.WMV

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13.23 @ 102 and dropping
believe it or not no nitrous or blower!

I have the 80 Series Crossflow under my car and paid the local muffler guy $125 to mandrel bend and install the 2.5" aluminized pipes from the collectors all the way out the back. Looks and sounds very nice. Fairly quiet IMO.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by jeff81:
For about $50 more, buy a Flowmaster system through Summit Racing. It's 2 1/2 inches and has all mandrel bends with a single dual inlet / dual outlet muffler. It's made for application to headers, and I think is listed to fit '70 to '74 Camaro / Firebird, but will fit all through '81.
If you get it, you may have to cut one of the front pipes due to different header lengths.</font>


I had not looked in their catalouge yet when I posted this, the Flowmaster system looks very good. Is it the FLO-17149 or the FLO-17104 you are reffering to?

They're referring to the 17104 kit. I have that one as well. To tell you the truth, I'm kind of sick of it. I think the interior resonance is too overwhelming while cruising at about 2000-2500 rpm. It just resonates in the rear seat area and is really annoying. Also, the heat sheild on the muffler seems to vibrate at certain rpms off idle. All the tack welds are still holding. I think the body of the heat sheild in the center vibrates and annoys the hell out of me. Third, if you have to do any work on the rear end, like pulling the axles for any reason, the stupid muffler can be in the way where it is.
But the sound is nice. It's quiet at idle and part throttle, but when you lay into the throttle, sounds like a banshee.

I think I might cut the muffler out and install something else, in true-dual fashion. Not sure what though. I do like the sound of Dakdawn's super-turbo's.

On a lighter note, ground clearance is excellent with this kit. The lowest part(s) of the exhaust system is the header collector flanges.

[This message has been edited by engine (edited January 02, 2005).]

I looked in CI catalouge again and I don't know how I can have missed them before but there is pictures of the same exhaust systems that Summit sells.

The system for 70-73, where will the mufflers be placed when it's installed? will there be any clereance problems regarding the mufflers versus ground?
http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload1/Exhaust3.jpg


The 67-74 system, looks more like original style muffler.
http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload1/Exhaust2.jpg


Anyone have pictures of these systems installed on their Camaro?

If you was going to buy one of these systems for your car, which one would you take?

If you have one of them installed, are you happy with it?

Thanks /Magnus

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by engine:
They're referring to the 17104 kit. I have that one as well. To tell you the truth, I'm kind of sick of it. I think the interior resonance is too overwhelming while cruising at about 2000-2500 rpm. It just resonates in the rear seat area and is really annoying. Also, the heat sheild on the muffler seems to vibrate at certain rpms off idle. All the tack welds are still holding. I think the body of the heat sheild in the center vibrates and annoys the hell out of me. Third, if you have to do any work on the rear end, like pulling the axles for any reason, the stupid muffler can be in the way where it is.
But the sound is nice. It's quiet at idle and part throttle, but when you lay into the throttle, sounds like a banshee.

I think I might cut the muffler out and install something else, in true-dual fashion. Not sure what though. I do like the sound of Dakdawn's super-turbo's.

On a lighter note, ground clearance is excellent with this kit. The lowest part(s) of the exhaust system is the header collector flanges.

[This message has been edited by engine (edited January 02, 2005).]</font>

Thats the kind of info I want to know, anyone else share this about the 17104 kit. Thanks for your input engine.

i´ve got the 17149 kit and it is very loud and my engine isn´t very powerfull at all. it resonates like hell as engine said. mainly when idling in front of a traffic light, the lowest part is the header flanges but i think if you use shorty headers instead of full length you´ll be ok..
the quality of this kit´s really good as far as i´m concerned.. overall i really like it, i like the noise http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

it might take me sometime but i could go out and make a few pics for you if you want..

cheers,

------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

I have the flowmaster one muffler set up on my car. I can send you a video clip with sound if you like. I didn't do the original installation, so I had to do some tweaking to get it to fit right after I put bigger tires on the car. I like the way it sounds, but if I had to do it over again, I prefer true dual exhaust from a performance standpoint, but the ground clearence becomes an issue when you do.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Charlie Brengun:
i´ve got the 17149 kit and it is very loud and my engine isn´t very powerfull at all. it resonates like hell as engine said. mainly when idling in front of a traffic light, the lowest part is the header flanges but i think if you use shorty headers instead of full length you´ll be ok..
the quality of this kit´s really good as far as i´m concerned.. overall i really like it, i like the noise http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

it might take me sometime but i could go out and make a few pics for you if you want..

cheers,

</font>

I am starting to like that kit more and more now, it would be great if you want to take some pictures of it. Just if you have the time, no hurry at all for me, I will not make the order for a while anyway.

Is the 17149 system you got made to fit headers or original manifolds?

How is it attached to the car, what kind of hinges are useed?

Thanks /Magnus

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by theflash:
I have the flowmaster one muffler set up on my car. I can send you a video clip with sound if you like. I didn't do the original installation, so I had to do some tweaking to get it to fit right after I put bigger tires on the car. I like the way it sounds, but if I had to do it over again, I prefer true dual exhaust from a performance standpoint, but the ground clearence becomes an issue when you do.</font>

You don't have to send the sound clip, thanks anyway. Yes the ground clearence does'nt become a problem anymore with the one muffler setup, there is both good and bad things with both systems. So you would go for the true dual exhaust if you had to change exhaust again.

Thanks for your help /Magnus

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Magnus:
I am starting to like that kit more and more now, it would be great if you want to take some pictures of it. Just if you have the time, no hurry at all for me, I will not make the order for a while anyway.

Is the 17149 system you got made to fit headers or original manifolds?

How is it attached to the car, what kind of hinges are useed?

Thanks /Magnus</font>

if my stuff has come in i should be pulling wires through my car tomorrow.. so i´ll be able to get pictures for you then.

i´m not sure if it will fit the original manifolds, i´ve got long tube headers on my car and it fits pretty well, if Sweden is filled with speedbumps like holland is you´ll be crawling over them.. i have to.. everytime..

i´m using the cheap long tube flowtech headers and next time i need a new set i´m getting shorties and will just add a little pipe to the exhaust system to make it fit.. that should give me enough ground clearence..


------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Charlie Brengun:
if my stuff has come in i should be pulling wires through my car tomorrow.. so i´ll be able to get pictures for you then.

i´m not sure if it will fit the original manifolds, i´ve got long tube headers on my car and it fits pretty well, if Sweden is filled with speedbumps like holland is you´ll be crawling over them.. i have to.. everytime..

i´m using the cheap long tube flowtech headers and next time i need a new set i´m getting shorties and will just add a little pipe to the exhaust system to make it fit.. that should give me enough ground clearence..


</font>


That sounds great

Yes they love speedbumps here to but I have to crawl over them already with the system I have now so I am used to it. I have headers on my Camaro to, just woundered if I had to shorten the new system or if it had the right lenght already.

Thanks /Magnus

Hey Magnus, I just repaired my modem...have been off-line for a few. Listen, what I did to help with the resonanance problem under the rear seat was to NOT use the tab type mounts the system comes with. I cut them off and used the original body mount spots located at each end of the muffler. The rubber under floor mounting brackets Flowmaster supplies will match up perfectly to the mounts located topside in the differential tunnel. Use 4 large body lag-bolts to attach, bend an "L" shape out of 1" wide steel and attach to the tail-pipe coming out of the muffler with a clamp.
In doing this, the muffler is hung straight and up tight in the diff-tunnel.
This should cut down on the resonance factor and keep from having to drill holes in your floor. I definitely like not having the duals hanging under the car. This system allows you to get a nice clean and tight fit for ground clearance. You will have to make a few cuts on the front pipes to match up to your headers.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by jeff81:
Hey Magnus, I just repaired my modem...have been off-line for a few. Listen, what I did to help with the resonanance problem under the rear seat was to NOT use the tab type mounts the system comes with. I cut them off and used the original body mount spots located at each end of the muffler. The rubber under floor mounting brackets Flowmaster supplies will match up perfectly to the mounts located topside in the differential tunnel. Use 4 large body lag-bolts to attach, bend an "L" shape out of 1" wide steel and attach to the tail-pipe coming out of the muffler with a clamp.
In doing this, the muffler is hung straight and up tight in the diff-tunnel.
This should cut down on the resonance factor and keep from having to drill holes in your floor. I definitely like not having the duals hanging under the car. This system allows you to get a nice clean and tight fit for ground clearance. You will have to make a few cuts on the front pipes to match up to your headers.</font>

That sounds intressting, do you have any pictures of the installation, its easier to get how its done when seeing it.

Thanks for the advice /Magnus

Sorry Magnus, no camera.

Magnus, i didn´t bring my camera along with me yesterday (dumb me), but i´ll take those pics over the weekend and post them here on monday.

cheers,

------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by jeff81:
Sorry Magnus, no camera.</font>

Ok, thanks for the help anyway.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Charlie Brengun:
Magnus, i didn´t bring my camera along with me yesterday (dumb me), but i´ll take those pics over the weekend and post them here on monday.

cheers,

</font>

Sounds great /Magnus

Magnus, There is a dealer of ours in Linkoping. Americano Enterprises. You may want to get a price quote from them. It's going to cost you a small fortune to ship that system from California to Sweden.

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Fool around, get hurt, don't come crying to me

A company called Retroparts ship the stuff I need for me so the cost will not be that large buy I will call Americano and see what they charge for the system. I have bought stuff from them as well.

How are you familiar with Americano Enterprises?

I looked at your homepage and saw the systems SGF16 and SGF17 for 70-81 Camaro.

Do they have a good fit, is it like the flowmaster system?

Does Americana Enterprises sell them?

You don't want to get the flowmaster system the H pipe design they use is absolete you want to find a system with an X-pipe. Their are quite a few out their and they run about the same price if not cheaper then the flow masters. If I am not mistaken the tips on the flow master are not polished or chromed. Now in regards to clearance a good true dual setup on the camaro will not come lower then the subframe if installed correctly. My car has a 2 drop and the only clearance issues I have are at the header collector and the bolt in subframe connect connecting points.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Ccass:
Magnus, There is a dealer of ours in Linkoping. Americano Enterprises. You may want to get a price quote from them. It's going to cost you a small fortune to ship that system from California to Sweden.

</font>

I checked with Americano Enterprises and they are much more expensive (14 Swedish crowns/$) than the other companys (12 crowns/$) so I think I will go for the Flowmaster system. Thanks for the tips anyway /Magnus

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by mjoc:
You don't want to get the flowmaster system the H pipe design they use is absolete you want to find a system with an X-pipe. Their are quite a few out their and they run about the same price if not cheaper then the flow masters. If I am not mistaken the tips on the flow master are not polished or chromed. Now in regards to clearance a good true dual setup on the camaro will not come lower then the subframe if installed correctly. My car has a 2 drop and the only clearance issues I have are at the header collector and the bolt in subframe connect connecting points.</font>

Yes I know that there is a lot of different systems out there than the Flowmaster. The main reason I choose them is that I can easily get it shipped here to Sweden because there is a shop that ship stuff from Classic Industries, the other systems are more risky to get because I have to ship them myself and there its a big chance they disapear somewhere on the way. Thanks for the tip anyway /Magnus

sorry it took me so long to get them.. but here's what i got..

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0151.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0152.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0154.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0155.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0156.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0147.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0148.JPG

but didn't you get a big block? if you're planning on using that in the camaro you might consider a 3 inch system instead of a 2.5 inch system..

------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

http://community.webshots.com/album/74189206ubSNDz

Add a crossover and you have a complete exhaust package for about $500 including painted headers. Even for a big block. The information for the guy I ordered from is on the pictures.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Charlie Brengun:
sorry it took me so long to get them.. but here's what i got..

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0151.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0152.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0154.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0155.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0156.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0147.JPG

http://upload.79camaro.com/cpg/albums/userpics/normal_DSCF0148.JPG

but didn't you get a big block? if you're planning on using that in the camaro you might consider a 3 inch system instead of a 2.5 inch system..

</font>


Those pictures where great, thanks alot.
I see that you use the same attatching points as the original brackets had for the tail pipes but the bracket look different from original, does this "different" bracket come with the kit.

Where are the system more mounted than on this bracket? under the floor? do I have to drill holes?

Yes I had BB plans but I have changed them. Trust me I have been thinking about what to do and I have decided to tune the 350 instead, it will probably be a 383 when I am done.

Once again thanks for those great pictures, you have sure helped me out here.

no prob with the pics, i allways like taking pictures of the car http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

i think it hangs on the headers & the brackets in the rear. needed holes there for that bracket, but my car didn´t come with duals originally..

a 383 stroker sounds pretty good.. what are you going to do with the 454? is it for sale http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/smile.gif?
------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

[This message has been edited by Charlie Brengun (edited January 13, 2005).]

Ok, I dont know if the mounting places for the original exhaust hangers is different between a 72 and a 77, I will have to check that out this weekend, the installation of the exhaust system you have made looks great.

BTW I dont remember if I have asked this before but will all the hangers and brackets be included in the 17149 kit?

I guess that I will sell the 454 when I got the time. I think a 383 will be a great enging for my needs, less weight than a BB so turning is still a possibility, on the other hand less tourqe too, it depends what to use the car for. A BB quarter mile compeditor is as cool as it can be so it would be fun having it in the Camaro but I will go for the 383.

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by 73454:
http://community.webshots.com/album/74189206ubSNDz

Add a crossover and you have a complete exhaust package for about $500 including painted headers. Even for a big block. The information for the guy I ordered from is on the pictures.</font>


That system looks great to but I think I will go for the Flowmaster system, thanks for the tip anyway /Magnus

Charlie, when I look at the picture where your headers are showing I see that they are a couple of inches longer than mine, is the system long enough to fit my shorter or is it made for longer headers? or is it maybe so long that it fits all types of headers and I have to cut it to the right lenght myself?

these are the headers i've got.. flowtech headers (http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&part=BIG%2D11100FLT&N=120+4294923429+4294923428+302953)

this is what we're looking for.. 17149 kit (http://www.flowmastermufflers.com/cgi-bin/flowmaster/17149.html)
the cones (part # tb296 in the picture) allows for some adjustment but i think you will need full length headers to make it fit (like the flowtechs) and not the shorty header (http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&part=BIG%2D11102FLT&N=120+4294923429+4294923428+302953) type...

anyway you'd sell your BBC? well i want a BBC and then i would a new exhaust system so perhaps we could work out some kind of trade.
my exhaust system is quite new (installed at the end of summer last year) and hasn't seen many miles (stickers still on it). so if you're interested let me know and we could discuss it.

cheers,

------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

Thats a great picture of the system, the thing that worries me is that Flowmaster themself charges $560 and Classic Industries and Summit charges $350 for the system, how can it be that way?

My headers are not the shorty type, they are just a little shorter than yours, I guess the TB296 part will be enough to make them fit, my headers look like this

http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload7/Headers.jpg


I am sorry to say it but if I am going to sell the 454 I have already a buyer, I have promised a friend of mine that he can buy it from me if I am going to sell, he have been nagging me about it for the last year because he wants it for his 68 Corvette. Otherwise I would be glad to sell it to you but I have to keep that promise, sorry about that.

Magnus

buy it from summit http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif i don't know why they are cheaper..

those headers should work just fine.. although next time i'm getting new headers i'm going fot the shorty style and getting ceramic coated ones..

too bad about the engine, i would have loved to have a 454 under the hood.. have to keep on looking then http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

------------------
"Son, a woman is like a beer. They smell good, they look good, you'd step over your own mother just to get one! But you can't stop at one. You wanna drink another woman!" - Homer J. Simpson

1977 Camaro Sports Coupe (http://home.zonnet.nl/ksstone)

Yes, sorry about the 454, it feels bad now when you have been helping me out so much.

Thanks for all the help I have got here by you guys, especially you Charlie, I owe you a big one for all the help you have been giving me.

I will let you know when I get the system, it will take about two month or so.

Magnus

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"If you're under control, you're not going fast enough"

1972 Rally Sport (Show car)
1982 Z28E (Daily Driver)