It is only a Sport coupe. I was planning on replacing the cam shaft. I bought a 1500 - 5000 rpm, trying to keep it simple. I figured I would also replace the timing chain, since I would be in there, with a double and put in roller rockers. One part of me feels like a little upgrade/ improvement (roller rockers/less friction) and one part of me keeps feeling guilty like since it's a numbers matching, keep it strictly oringinal specs. I don't know what to do.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

Michelle,

Bolt on improvements can be wonderful things, but in your case my gut tells me to leave it stock.

"Bolt on" horsepower is great, but to really make it worth your while you need to modify (and match) each link in the "airflow chain". In other words, changing a cam without intake, cylinder head, and exhaust improvements is a poor bang for the buck / bang for the effort proposition, IMHO. I would be surprised if you picked any truly meaningful power improvement. Sure, you can probably add 20 peak horsepower which is probably 10% or so. You won't feel any real difference south of the 3,000 - 5,000 rpm band. Now, if you like driving in the 3,000 - 5,000 rpm band then a simple cam change on an otherwise stock engine won't satify you.

Once you start down the slope, it gets mighty slippery mighty fast. You could easily use bolt ons to get to 350 horsepower (an improvement of 125 - 150 horsepower or so from where you probably are now). But you gotta use all of them (heads, cam, intake, exhaust). This would fundamentally transform the car into a true street machine. I would do it in a New York minute, but I sense a reluctance on your part stray so far from stock.

Also, don't apologize for "only" having Sport Coupe. You have a real "round tailights" car....good for you.

MikeM79, thanks for the chin up.

I am not going to try to boost HP too much as it would just be wasted. I am not the "time slip" type. Not that there is anything wrong with that, it's just not my cup of tea. So to put money into something that will not get used would be a waste. I just like to cruise and show. But, I sometimes feel like since this is a numbers matching car I may be doing it an injustice by changing too much. Then at times I feel like "oh, wouldn't it be cool to do this, that and the other thing". I guess i'm just being a bit indecisive.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

I Have to agree with Mike79. Once you start going down that slope it gets pretty slippery. I bought my car new in 73 and didn't change a thing until I joined this board. The car had just over 30,000 when I joined and I have change everything. I don't regret it at all in fact I like it a lot better now. I have driven it more in the last 2yrs than I ever had. The one thing I did was bag and tag ever part I changed so I can put it back to the way it was when I drove it home from the dealer.

Now it has 650+HP and is a lot of fun to drive. all original parts are on the self at the shop.

I have a different oppinion.

IMO A #s sport coupe is not going to be a supper valuable collector some day. It is kinda cool though.

If you want to keep the original engine original but want some HP improvement to enjoy driving the car more, I would suggest saving your money and purchasing another engine (crate, or have one built) that has a little over 300 HP. . . this will wake up that little camaro and give you years of driving enjoyment.
Save the original engine just incase you want to put it back original oneday.

For me, make it the way you want it to enjoy it and keep the original stuff for down the road if needed.

Have fun!!
Cya
ratchet

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RaTcheTmasTer
Moderator http://www.gmforums.com
1968 RS SS
1973 RS LT Z28
other cars:
1969 olds 442 convertible
1972 454 elcamino
1995 WWW LT1 Caprice B4U
1999 Pontiac Firebird T/A WS-6


http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/preview/du/dugo/usflag.gif
CARS ARE THE ESSENCE OF MY EXISTENCE!!

I have to agree with Mike. I have thought of upgrading mine many times but never can seem to bring myself to do it and I dont really have the room to store my 307 if I were to replace it. IMO, spend your time & money appearence & safety fixes. Looks nice already but looks like you can use the infamous shoulder belt clips.

sounds like you want to keep it original, but want the 'ok' to hotrod it. not wanting to sound like a jerk, but i went thru the same thing with our 71 SS, it was so unmolested i went back and forth about what to do with it, i asked my freinds what they would do, and mulled it over in my mind many times. in the end, we kept it totally stock, bone stock, the way GM rolled it off the line [other than wheels/tires], the only thing that made it a bit easier is we had another car that we 'did up' the way we wanted it [ we=me and the wife].

if you can, keep it original, and get another one that's not original and go to town on it.

one last question though....., are those your feet in that trunk picture? http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/smile.gif

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71 ss 350/4spd 69 nova 350/th350 www.americaniron.net (http://www.americaniron.net)

If everyone keeps customizing their Sport Coupes then mine will be the only original around!! http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

I think I will only make small changes but keep the originals. I know there are a few things that are not original already but the drivetrain is my main concern. Paint and stripes are cosmetic.

No those are not my feet! Those are my daughters and you can see my sons stomach! Kids, they appear in the darnest places. I think I need new pictures! http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

[This message has been edited by MJwrabbit (edited November 08, 2002).]

Bowtie70, what shoulder belt clips?

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

only reason i kid about the feet is that on another site i go to, a guy takes pic's of his car, parts for it, upgrades etc., and his feet always seem to be in the pic. i just got a chuckle out of it. http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/smile.gif

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71 ss 350/4spd 69 nova 350/th350 www.americaniron.net (http://www.americaniron.net)

Screw it, skip the roller rockers, spend the $200 and slide in a low end torque, RV cam for some noticable lower end power and probably better gas mileage. Replace the original nylon cam chain setup with a double roller style. The nylon is probably cracked and ready to fall apart after 30 years anyway. It's a cheap modification and can be returned to stock cheap and easy. Just get a box and keep the original stuff (number the lifters for original locations).

see, I don't use my own feet, I get someone elses! http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/wink.gif

Well, I think I am not going to put in the roller rockers at this time. I will stick with the 1500-5000RPM cam. I am not one to go to the track so high HP would be wasted. I do have a double roller timing chain though. If I decide to put in roller rockers I can always take it apart again. Afterall aren't these cars meant to be worked on?

I never thought to number the lifters, thanks Psychohamster!

What do you clean carb parts with? I am rebuilding my carb along with my cam project.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by MJwrabbit:
Bowtie70, what shoulder belt clips?

</font>

MJwrabbit, one of your pictures seems to show the shoulder belt hanging down in the back seat. There is suppose to be a plastic clip over the door window on the headliner to attach the belt to. The original plastic was pretty poor and usually the clip is broken off. If that is what happened to yours, the only place that sells them is www.camaros.com (http://www.camaros.com) at $45/pr.

Bowtie70, I thought thats what you were talking about. I have them but your right, They are VERY brittle. The day I got my car home my son said "oh mom, is this what these do?" SNAP!

Of course, I did all I could do not to KILL him! Those are on the top of my Christmas List! I know, they are expensive for two small pieces of plastic!

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

Uh, on page 4 you list an edelbrock intake and holley carb??
Is this still your car in the list?:

http://www.cardomain.com/member_pages/view_page.pl?page_id=146487&page=4

[This message has been edited by WildBillyT (edited November 13, 2002).]

Yes, the holley and the eldelbrock were on the car when I bought it. I do not believe these are original. I have been toying with the idea to find an original setup. I don't know how hard this would be to do or how practical. This is another reason I am on the fence to keep it as stock as possible or not. I believe the previous owner was trying to make a Z clone out of the car.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

Well, MJ, Looking at all the aftermarket I can see on your car, I think it would be alright to change things you don't see. I just sold a 71 numbers matching car to an old neighbor of yours, Chris C. the tewks. cop. and we have completely rebuilt the motor to stock specs. but threw some chrome and other stuff under the hood. he did keep all the original because someday those plain jane camaro's may be worth something. too many of them were cut up and crushed. so they are the rare ones.

dml1968, that is exactly my point. I don't want to change anymore than what is already done as I fear I am doing the car an injustice. On the other hand, like you said, as long as I keep all the stock parts so I can put it back, when the time comes, I can do so. I will have to give Chris a call. Did you tell him about this site???

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

what carb and intake did these cars come with and how hard are they to find? Can I buy them new?

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

not too hard, did it have a 307? the carb should be a 2 barrell stock and you can still get a remanned from napa

no, 350/250HP. I checked the numbers on the engine. It's a numbers matching car, engine, tranny & body, checked them all.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

[This message has been edited by MJwrabbit (edited November 18, 2002).]

Let me make another attempt at taking the "other" side.

First off, your car is not all original. It may retain many original parts, but not 100% original.

IF you wanted to keep it "ALL" original, then why drive it??

Put it an a garage and only bring it out for a car show were everyone can say "Does that car have the original rocker arms still??" You can then reply "Why yes!!" Then they will say "Woowwwww Awesome!!"

I am sorry but to me, this is ludicrous. http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/frown.gif http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/frown.gif

Make the freeking car the way you want it and drive it. . . stop waisting time worrying about little crap like "original rockers". I am sorry, but that is just plain crazy.

Build it. Drive it. Enjoy it. That is what these cars were made for. http://www.nastyz28.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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RaTcheTmasTer
Moderator http://www.gmforums.com
1968 RS SS
1973 RS LT Z28
other cars:
1969 olds 442 convertible
1972 454 elcamino
1995 WWW LT1 Caprice B4U
1999 Pontiac Firebird T/A WS-6


http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/preview/du/dugo/usflag.gif
CARS ARE THE ESSENCE OF MY EXISTENCE!!

[This message has been edited by raTchetmasTer (edited November 18, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by raTchetmasTer (edited November 18, 2002).]

Originally posted by raTchetmasTer:
Let me make another attempt at taking the "other" side.
First off, your car is not all original. It may retain many original parts, but not 100% original.
I never said it was 100% original. I am trying to decide whether to put it that way.

IF you wanted to keep it "ALL" original, then why drive it??
I think these cars are fun to drive whether original or custom.

Put it an a garage and only bring it out for a car show were everyone can say "Does that car have the original rocker arms still??" You can then reply "Why yes!!" Then they will say "Woowwwww Awesome!!"
I don't drive mine everyday. I take it to shows and cruises and enjoy the people I meet there. I drive it on occasion just to drive it.

I am sorry but to me, this is ludicrous.
I'm sorry this post is so upsetting to you.

Make the freeking car the way you want it and drive it. . . stop waisting time worrying about little crap like "original rockers". I am sorry, but that is just plain crazy.
That is what this post is for. I can't decide the way I want the car. People who have replied have bropught up points that I did not think of which is making my decision easier. There are some people who take "crap" like original rockers very seriously. I think it's cool.

Build it. Drive it. Enjoy it. That is what these cars were made for.
I agree. I used to be worried about mileage as it only has 51,000 miles on it but now I have decided to take it on farther trips as I am missing out on soome fun events.

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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit

[This message has been edited by MJwrabbit (edited November 18, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by MJwrabbit (edited November 18, 2002).]

<font face="Arial,Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by MJwrabbit:
I never thought to number the lifters, thanks Psychohamster!

What do you clean carb parts with? I am rebuilding my carb along with my cam project.
</font>

If you were ever to re-use that cam the lifters need to go on the exact same lobe as they were broken in with.
As far as a carb cleaner, there is a good product from Chemtool called Chem-Dip, It is made especially for carburator parts cleaning. It comes ina one gallon paint can and has a dip basket inside. This stuff will clean the hell outta carb parts, but the only problem is the smell. Even after getting rid of the can and multiple washing/hoseing down the area where this stuff was, it still smells like a toxic waste dump (up to and over one year later). I'd recommend having a pro do your carb work.
As far as roller rocker arms go, for the price to invest in them the gains would be nominal,(probably not even noticable), with a somewhat stock engine. I would suggest in just buying some locking rocker arm adjusting bolts and put the "roller rocker" money into an exhaust system or other area like tranny mods(for an auto).

Psychohamster, What I failed to mention is the reason I am doing this cam project is there is a ticking in the engine and I "think" it's the cam. It's quite possible that a lobe has worn (softened). So, it is doubtful that I will use the cam over (unless that turns out not to be the problem). I will number everything, etc. just in case. Can you still get stock cams from GM?


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Michelle
1971 Sport Coupe, matching numbers, 51,000 original miles.
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mjwrabbit