Hey all- I just picked up a 327 from a friend today and took it apart to find a steel crank with .040 forged pistons crank was turned all rods where freshened up with new bolts and internally balanced- 292 lunati cam, it looks like it might have 400 miles on this motor:) . My question is- what type of HP this may put out with a set of 194's and a nice jet stage 2 QJ atop a edlebrock rpm with a good summit HEI? What would a 327 like this be worth????:bowtie:

close to 375 to 400 hp i bet, worth maybe 2500....

close to 375 to 400 hp i bet, worth maybe 2500....


I think both of these numbers are a little optimistic. Stock 327 performance engines from that time frame were rated at 300 and 357 hp, except for the fuel injected Corvettes. The hp ratings were gross engine figures, which differs from the net ratings car manufacturers use today. Depending on heads, I would put the figure around 300 - 325. As for price, unless the engine is specific to a collector's needs, I think one would have a tough time getting that kind of $$. I occasionally run across older 327 engines for $200-$400. These are stock passenger car engines, but could be rebuilt and set up to run well for much less than $2500. JMO.

Thanks guys- I was wondering if steel crank 327's are worth anything. I purchased this for 200$ I think i got an excellent deal. I too was thinking around 350HP maybe... Anyway thanks

Thanks guys- I was wondering if steel crank 327's are worth anything. I purchased this for 200$ I think i got an excellent deal. I too was thinking around 350HP maybe... Anyway thanks

Only if it was a large journal steel 327 crank pretty rare only came in buses if I remember correct , although the older it gets the less common it becomes and to the right person who knows

I've got 2 large journal steel 327 cranks.....not that rare.

$2500 LOLOLOL take one zero off that number. I have a 67 small main 327, 30 over, TRW forged pistons, and I put it in my work truck with 10:1 compression and ported heads on it.

The 327 is a 350 with a shorter stroke, nothing more nothing less. So whatever HP you'd get out of a 350, it will make slightly less. Since it is an SBC of reasonable displacement, of course it will run great if you build it nice.

Not worth anything special, if you got it use it though.

$2500 LOLOLOL take one zero off that number. I have a 67 small main 327, 30 over, TRW forged pistons, and I put it in my work truck with 10:1 compression and ported heads on it.

The 327 is a 350 with a shorter stroke, nothing more nothing less. So whatever HP you'd get out of a 350, it will make slightly less.

Gets a bit better gas mileage too! :bowtie:

In the northeast motor prices are crazy high.... take a look in craigslist.. and they get it to...

327 getting better gas mileage than a 350? I doubt it. Big bore short stroke is not the direction to go for gas mileage. An LS1 is more like a 305 - small bore, long stroke.

327 getting better gas mileage than a 350? I doubt it. Big bore short stroke is not the direction to go for gas mileage. An LS1 is more like a 305 - small bore, long stroke.

Has more to do with the cam, heads, and CR than displacement... most 305s and 350s get about the same mileage if built similarly. The 5.0/5.7 TPI engines are good examples of that.

I've got 2 large journal steel 327 cranks.....not that rare.

Maybe they are just a little less common on this side of the border , or Louich is hiding them all :)

Has more to do with...
Experience.

Then you know for sure. :)

There is nothing wrong with a stoutly built 327 sbc...... the 327 is considered one of the best sbc configurations ever designed.....and yes my numbers are a little high....

Are you sure that it's a forged steel crank? Almost all small journal 327 (3.25" stroke cranks) were forged (maybe even all of them). From my experience, I've never seen a factory forged steel large journal 327 crank. The test for it (assuming that the crank isn't cracked) is to suspend it from a rope then hit it with a hammer. If it rings, its forged. If it has a dull ring, it's cast.

As for power and economy: 1) there is NO substitute for cubic inches. The ONLY difference between a 327 and a 350 is the stroke. 327 is 3.25" and the 350 is 3.48". 2) economy is related more to vehicle weight, aerodynamics, and rolling resistance than to the size of the engine. EX: friend of mine had a 1966 Chevy Suburban with a 283 that got 14 mpg. He put a 402 BBC in it's place and got, (wait for it), 14 mpg! His anology was, "you can only push a barn door down the road so fast and it's going to take 14 mpg to do it!" LOL!

Suprize! 327's almost always had steel cranks,, finding one with a cast crank is rare.
Power from a mild 327,,,,,300-325HP
There is no such thing in the ENTIRE universe as 200$

A good used engine is worth anywhere between $1-$1,000 depends on how used and how bad you want it.

ALL small-journal 327's had forged cranks. :bowtie:

The large journal 327 ('68 & '69) usually had a cast crank; only the H/P (think vettes) & H/D (trucks) got the forged crank. The cast crank is the same crank as used in the 307. I've seen only one large-journal forged 327 crank - it came from a school bus motor.

To tell the difference from a forged & cast crank look at the casting / parting line. The cast crank has a narrow sharp line while a forged crank has a low wide (~1/4") line - looks like it was ground off. Sorry, I don't have a picture handy

Check out some of the factory ratings for the 327:
275-300hp for a 4bbl Q-jet cast-iron intake, flat-top pistons w/ 1.94 heads & a medium hyd cam.
350hp for a 4bbl Holley alum hi-rise intake, 11:1 pistons w/ 2.02 heads & a moderate (by todays standards) hyd cam.
375hp same as above but with factory solid cam (30/30 cam - same as 69 Z-28).

Of course, these were ratings at the flywheel.
Dang fine engine IMO, as said before it's worth more for a period correct car. Not $2500 worth (unless it's a complete '66 Nova 350hp motor!).

Are you sure that it's a forged steel crank? Almost all small journal 327 (3.25" stroke cranks) were forged (maybe even all of them). From my experience, I've never seen a factory forged steel large journal 327 crank. The test for it (assuming that the crank isn't cracked) is to suspend it from a rope then hit it with a hammer. If it rings, its forged. If it has a dull ring, it's cast.

As for power and economy: 1) there is NO substitute for cubic inches. The ONLY difference between a 327 and a 350 is the stroke. 327 is 3.25" and the 350 is 3.48". 2) economy is related more to vehicle weight, aerodynamics, and rolling resistance than to the size of the engine. EX: friend of mine had a 1966 Chevy Suburban with a 283 that got 14 mpg. He put a 402 BBC in it's place and got, (wait for it), 14 mpg! His anology was, "you can only push a barn door down the road so fast and it's going to take 14 mpg to do it!" LOL!

All small journals that I've seen are steel cranks , when they went to large journal they figured that the increase in dia. ment that they could get away without it being steel and atleast on this side of the border they were all cast iron cranks except for the ones in buses , if you've got a large journal steel crank post a picture of it because you can tell by the forging line if it is steel or cast , steel it will be wide like your finger if it's narrow like the end of a slot screw driver it's not steel it's cast

ALL small-journal 327's had forged cranks. :bowtie:

The large journal 327 ('68 & '69) usually had a cast crank; only the H/P (think vettes) & H/D (trucks) got the forged crank. The cast crank is the same crank as used in the 307. I've seen only one large-journal forged 327 crank - it came from a school bus motor.

To tell the difference from a forged & cast crank look at the casting / parting line. The cast crank has a narrow sharp line while a forged crank has a low wide (~1/4") line - looks like it was ground off. Sorry, I don't have a picture handy

Check out some of the factory ratings for the 327:
275-300hp for a 4bbl Q-jet cast-iron intake, flat-top pistons w/ 1.94 heads & a medium hyd cam.
350hp for a 4bbl Holley alum hi-rise intake, 11:1 pistons w/ 2.02 heads & a moderate (by todays standards) hyd cam.
375hp same as above but with factory solid cam (30/30 cam - same as 69 Z-28).

Of course, these were ratings at the flywheel.
Dang fine engine IMO, as said before it's worth more for a period correct car. Not $2500 worth (unless it's a complete '66 Nova 350hp motor!).

You beat me by a key stroke , should have taken typing in school I guess;)
Been through a few Vette motors and never saw a large journal steel , the only one I ever saw came out of a bus like the one you saw and I agree with you dang fine motor

You beat me by a key stroke , should have taken typing in school I guess;)
Been through a few Vette motors and never saw a large journal steel , the only one I ever saw came out of a bus like the one you saw and I agree with you dang fine motor

I'm not that fast of a typer - I just started sooner :p

The L/J steel crank I had I bought from a machine shop & thats what he said it was from (bus).
Gary

I'm not that fast of a typer - I just started sooner :p

The L/J steel crank I had I bought from a machine shop & thats what he said it was from (bus).
Gary

So it would have been a good race then , do you use one finger or two , just trying to figure out lenghts for the rematch;)

OK guys, the numbers on this deal are crazy, the block matches a 68 z28 the crank is a steel large journal but the block says it is a 302???? WTF:confused:

All small journals that I've seen are steel cranks , when they went to large journal they figured that the increase in dia. ment that they could get away without it being steel and atleast on this side of the border they were all cast iron cranks except for the ones in buses , if you've got a large journal steel crank post a picture of it because you can tell by the forging line if it is steel or cast , steel it will be wide like your finger if it's narrow like the end of a slot screw driver it's not steel it's cast
It is wide and for sure steel :bowtie:

Me thinks you are confusing yourself and us. You need to post the casting numbers on the block and crank along with the VIN that is on the passenger side front of the block just in front of where the head bolts on. PICTURES of everything would help too.

A 1968 Z28 motor would have a DZ stamped on the LF VIN pad. It would be a LARGE journal forged 3" stroke crank as would a 1969 be. A 1967 Z28 motor would also have the DZ on the VIN pad BUT it would be a SMALL journal 3" stroke crank.

Block casting numbers from mortec.com

3892657....302.....67....2...Z-28 Camaro

3914678....302.....68....2...Z-28 Camaro

3932386....302.....69....4...Z-28 Camaro

302 Crank Casting numbers:

3923279....302.......forged..medium journal...3.00" stroke

3941178....302.......forged..medium journal...3.00" stroke

3955618 302 69 Camaro,Z28

302
Chevrolet produced a special 302 cu in (4.9 L) engine for Trans Am racing from 1967-1969. It was the product of placing the 3-inch stroke crankshaft into a 4-inch bore block. The 302 used the same crank as the 265 and the 283.[5] When the journal size increased to the standard medium journal size, the crankshaft for the 302 was specially built of forged steel.[5] This engine was used only in the first-generation Camaro Z28. Conservatively rated at 290 hp (216 kW), actual output was around 375 hp (280 kW). This block is one of 3 displacements that underwent a transformation for the 1968/1969 period when the main bearing size was increased from 2.30 in to 2.45 in.

i traded a large journal 302 steel crank and rotating assembly i had for the carb on my car now. not many folks arround here are resto crazy,, and you can't hardly give away the 302 and 327 stuff.

the crank is still here in this town. the old school and older guy i traded to has passed away and is still stored somewhere in his collection of old school parts. the 302's l/j are harder to come by these days. i have a s/j 327 steel crank here in the garage. lots more common.
andy

Me thinks you are confusing yourself and us. You need to post the casting numbers on the block and crank along with the VIN that is on the passenger side front of the block just in front of where the head bolts on. PICTURES of everything would help too.

A 1968 Z28 motor would have MI or MO stamped on the LF VIN pad. It would be a LARGE journal forged 3" stroke crank as would a 1969 be. A 1967 Z28 motor would have on MO or MP on the VIN pad BUT it would be a SMALL journal 3" stroke crank.


The 69 is the only 'DZ' coded block. Don't even tease us that it may be a 68Z motor. Does it have a windage tray?

Post the numbers WITH pics ASAP :bowtie:

3914678....302.....68....2...Z-28 Camaro is the block number for sure!
The crank is 4692 which is a large journal steel crank right? See pictures

Wish I could tell you if the dz was stamped on the from of the block deck, but this motor has been milled and the stamp is gone

I just got the crank back from being polished and all the rods checked.
I am putting the crank and pistons in tonight, I will measure the stroke and I am pretty sure this is a 327 with a large journal steel crank the block numbers are what is confusing me, but I also so that 68 had 302-327- 350 all with that same block casting. Thanks for all the comments most helpful :bowtie:

It is definitely a 327 large journal crank guys

Me thinks I have a 302 block with a 327 steel crank, that is the only thing that makes sense... What do you guys think:confused:

i have had MANY 327 engine the Casting numbers have always been the same as 3914678 and the crank are 4672 mine is steel, And For Sure is a 1968 327 Large Jounal.

If you can Let me know the decking #'s i can decode them for you,

i have had MANY 327 engine the Casting numbers have always been the same as 3914678 and the crank are 4672 mine is steel, And For Sure is a 1968 327 Large Jounal.

If you can Let me know the decking #'s i can decode them for you,

The block has been zero decked so the numbers there are gone, thanks though :D

i have had MANY 327 engine the Casting numbers have always been the same as 3914678 and the crank are 4672 mine is steel, And For Sure is a 1968 327 Large Jounal.

If you can Let me know the decking #'s i can decode them for you,

Yes they will make power

Here is my street engine, more of a Pro Street engine

GM 327 block (350 journal size) with steel truck crank, Eagle 5.7" H Beam Rods, TRW Pistons (620grams plus wrist pin, WAY HEAVY, IMO 12:1 but didnt CC it as it is not a race engine to speak of), Cast iron "as cast" heads, solid roller, TH400 and 12 bolt with 5.38's

Race weight 4,080

The engine is 11.0 +/- when it hooks, the suspension back then was hit or miss and usually miss, here is one of the runs that was a miss. We did not use the transbrake, left from an idle, blew the tires off with a 1.765 60', ran 7.49 @94.93mph at the 1/8 and 11.645 @119.98mph lifting 50' or so before the stripe

In a Camaro, for sure it would be a 10.7/10.8 engine or in a lighter Chevelle

Our bigger engine is also a 327 but has a custom 40 pound billet crankshaft, 478gram aluminum rods and custom pistons @ 13.96:1 Compression :) :eek:

The engine right above is 100% race only

Here is the video of the pro street engine on the 11.645 @118.98mph lifting and spinning in low gear but still going, not super straight but the HP carried it to the ET
http://i510.photobucket.com/albums/s347/331Trmnatr/th_MVI_0362.jpg (http://s510.photobucket.com/albums/s347/331Trmnatr/?action=view&current=MVI_0362.flv)

Also missed the 1-2 shift, you can not see it in the video but the car has moving a good amount in the groove. Had to steer it a good bit, and right at the 1-2 shift the tires spun and the RPMs when up. Off the line when it spun the RPMs went over 9k

The 2-3 shift was right at 8100 on the nose, IIRC the 1-2 shift was not until 9k plus. It ran a lower rpm than usual through the lights due to us lifting, that was ~8300rpm

That is a common early large journal 4" bore block. My engine builder has several of them. They are usually 327's - same as the crank.

With the numbers milled off the deck, I would bet thats just a good 327 that has been built up some.

Are you sure that it's a forged steel crank? Almost all small journal 327 (3.25" stroke cranks) were forged (maybe even all of them). From my experience, I've never seen a factory forged steel large journal 327 crank. The test for it (assuming that the crank isn't cracked) is to suspend it from a rope then hit it with a hammer. If it rings, its forged. If it has a dull ring, it's cast.

As for power and economy: 1) there is NO substitute for cubic inches. The ONLY difference between a 327 and a 350 is the stroke. 327 is 3.25" and the 350 is 3.48". 2) economy is related more to vehicle weight, aerodynamics, and rolling resistance than to the size of the engine. EX: friend of mine had a 1966 Chevy Suburban with a 283 that got 14 mpg. He put a 402 BBC in it's place and got, (wait for it), 14 mpg! His anology was, "you can only push a barn door down the road so fast and it's going to take 14 mpg to do it!" LOL!
1968 was the only year for steel large journal 327 cranks trucks only maby a bus or two LOl,, >>> never seen a small journal 327 or 283 or 265 that was not steel EVERY THING WAS STEEL BACK IN THE DAY .. need to HANG YOU FROM A ROPE AND HAMMER YOU lol LOOK AT THE PARTING LINE ON THE CRANK CAST IS THIN ,,STEEL IS WIDE FROM BEING FORGED hang from rope wow


OLD CHEVYS NEVER DIE THEY JUST GO FASTER !!!!!!

PS I HAVE GOT 535 REAL HP OUT OF A LJ 327 but do to high rpm bang also a 350 makes the same power at 6000 a 327 makes 7500 that is y gm switched 5 years 50000 miles at 7500 is hard to do !!

PS I HAVE GOT 535 REAL HP OUT OF A LJ 327 but do to high rpm bang also a 350 makes the same power at 6000 a 327 makes 7500 that is y gm switched 5 years 50000 miles at 7500 is hard to do !!

LOL :p

That is a common early large journal 4" bore block. My engine builder has several of them. They are usually 327's - same as the crank.

With the numbers milled off the deck, I would bet thats just a good 327 that has been built up some.

Well as of today it is close to 10:1 compression,(heads and block have been milled) 194 heads (cast) Lunati 292 hyd cam advanced 4 degrees. Roller Rockers. 040 forged TRW, Bottom end balanced and RPM manifold (until I get an air gap) it should have a little power :) Not sure what HP it will be